Removing Merge[ edit ] I'm going to go ahead and be bold and remove the merge notice per my statements here. Note the merge notice has been hanging out since this stubby version  since October with no discussion.
Like the summary says, feel free to readd if you think it applies, but please go ahead and drop a note here. Bitnine16 February UTC copied from Yolgnu's Talk 31 Poetry chat : Hey, I appreciate all your efforts on the Catullus poems; I've been pretty lonely on them for some time now and it's nice to have poetry chat knowledgeable onboard. Can I make two suggestions, b'vakashah? I'm sure that the people who made the "literal" translations not me probably did so in good faith, and weren't trying to be lame.
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Generally, I agreed with your changes, but still, in my opinion, we shouldn't dampen the enthusiasm of people who sincerely want to contribute. Someday a professional Catullus scholar might see our work, and poetry chat she won't be scornful of our efforts, either.
Perhaps the safest thing to do poetry chat be to take over a public-domain, line-by-line translation and reference it — what do you think? I understand and poetrg your reasoning, but I think you have been hasty and not considered the context in which that material was added. We should at least Talk about it.
Talk:poetry of catullus
If you'd like to help with Catullus 2, please consider ing me in summarizing the available scholarship on Catullus 2, much of which is listed under the "Bibliography". Norman horny women you have other sources to add, that'd be great, too! I'm probably busy these next two weeks with other articles poetry chat potentialproblem of Apolloniuslist of scientific poetry chat of Albert EinsteinWillow talk31 March UTC copied from Willow's Talk 1 April : As to Catullus 10the version as it was made no sense, and was too far gone to be fixed.
Poetry chat wasn't your fault; it was anonymous users, and with some of them making word-for-word translations and worse, it's hard to tell whether their edits were in good faith or not. I'd say there are only a dozen or so that are see below. I can find more sources for it, but if we poetry chat it to ever be a good article, cht need to clean it up, unclog it and remove irrelevant material.
Your biography poetry chat Catullus was well written, but it really belongs on the Catullus poetty, not here. Also, there were two different sections on "manuscript tradition", which basically both said the same thing but with different words, so I merged them into one section a little bit messy; I'll clean it up later.
And another thing - I'll look for textual criticism sources ie. Do you mind if I delete that? All of those have already been made into articles except 62 quite long, chaf worth Naughty wife looking nsa Perdido Key93 historically important as it is about Catullus' relations with Caesar, and also includes the much discussed "I don't care if you are white or black" line. If there's nothing to say about a poem which is poetr case for a lot of the very short onesit shouldn't be here.
If it's not ificant in some way or another, we poetry chat consider deleting it.
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I also agree with you about my own work at Catullus 2 ; the division of the poem-unity discussion had long bothered me, but I'd been loath to change the article too boldly lest the original authors come poetry chat and, ummm, treat me Kindly. I agree that it would be silly if those parts were repeated for every Catullus poem — even the notable ones — but I think we can't assume that the reader is going to be willing to read the whole Catullus biography article just for the tidbits that are relevant here.
Some kind of summary style seems called for, don't you think? Also, as you can see from the article history, someone nominated the article prematurely for GA, and I worked like crazy to bring it up, but all in vain. So my assumption has been that my articles only have a chance of becoming GA's if I think they're worthy to be FA's; they always seem to have some failing that I've overlooked.
I agree with you that Santa cruz de tenerife for marriage list is like the "greatest hits" of Catullus, and we should work on those articles first — perhaps especially Catullus 5or Catullus 3 to match Catullus 2? Anyway, we have time to think all that through; good that you're here!
We should think on what to do with not so notable poems like Catullus 14b2740 poetry chat, 5258b6069and Perhaps they needn't each have their own article, though?
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I've been Serious sugar relationship that I was too inclusive in assuming notability on the basis of a few scholarly articles. Perhaps we could combine the minor poems into a few longer meta-articles, such as Invective poetry of Catullus and Lesbia poems of Catullus ; the sundry small poems could be different subsections with a paragraph or two, and the Married women seeking sex tonight Pembrokeshire scholarly articles could be cited as footnotes.
We could quote choice snippets to give the poem's feel Odi et amoor indeed the whole poem if it were short enough. I'll try to fill in the table List of poems by Catullus with themes next week. I don't mind losing the "obscenity" column; it was a little prudish and ORbut it occurred to me that some readers might want a quick way to know how obscene a poem was. On the other hand, Catullus 16 might be fun to work on after we finish Carmina ii, iii et v.
This whole week is booked with poetry chat potential Naked pussy in Mahanoy plane Pennsylvania, I'm afraid. Minor Lesbia poems of Catullus and Poems of unusual metre of Catullus would be much better than dozens of stubs. I'm not sure about Invective poemsthough; many, such as Catullus 16 and Catullus 47poetry chat important enough to warrant their own articles, but most are not worth mentioning. I think that is just about complete, aside from the themes.
But, sorting the by poem type, it turns out that most of Catullus' poems are invectives! That throws Invective poems out the window If you've read our discussions, you know that's not what we want; hence, there's no consensus. If you really want to contribute something to the poetry of Catullus and not destroy others' work, then dig up some scholarly references like the dozens I've placed on the s you're tagging.
If you're incapable or unwilling to do that, then at least please wait until both Yolgnu and I are free to Talk with you about what to do with the articles. I am simply trying to put this material in its appropriate place. I have tagged only those poems not represented on en.
~ poets of lates
Lonely housewives Downey mn the exception of Catullus 29these articles possess no assertions of notability. The articles, such as they are, will remain accessible within the histories. Aramgar talk29 May Poetry chat I am coming in cold to this poetry chat, so please do point me to any other discussion that has occurred.
That said, I agree with Aramgar's motive and actions to move texts to Wikisource when the articles here have very little content. On the other hand, Wikisource does permit collaborative translations to be created.
There the edit history of a translation is dedicated to the improvement of the translation, and can be readily inspected and discussed on the talk. At present, most of the poems with some exceptions, eg. Instead, the articles should consist of the original Latin along with a sourced discussion of the themes and poetic techniques and, where appropriate, images and a poetry chat of influence and textual criticism.
Removing the translations, however, will leave a large of s with nothing but the original Latin; Ladies want nsa OH Avon 44011 articles should be removed, unless they are among his famous Lesbia poems, in which case they should be merged into Minor Lesbia poems of Catulluswhich will briefly discuss all these poetry chat but nonetheless notable poems. Note that Willow is currently in the process of completing List of poems by Catullusso readers will at least be able to read a short description of every Catullus poem, including those not notable enough to have their own article.
Let me know if I can be of any assistance on the Wikisource side of things. All of the Lesbia poems, because of their length, are minor poems. The article could address all the related poems and has the virtue of removing the necessity of determining which poems are "major" and which are "minor". I included sub-s for three areas of persistent disagreement:.